![]() ![]() ![]() And Russia's worldview - the Russian - the contemporary Russian ideology is that the whole world is rotten. You know, all of us are interested in seeing our worldviews affirmed. And part of it - part of the goa is psychological. GESSEN: Well, actually, I think that causing unrest and consternation is an end in itself. But what about the misinformation campaign that we keep discovering more about, hacking, what seems to be just a lot of Russian involvement on a lot of different fronts? Why - what is the Russian interest in causing unrest or consternation in the United States or Western Europe? ![]() But, you know, if you are going to - I wouldn't draw the conclusion from it that we know something about collusion during the 2016 presidential campaign. GESSEN: Is he trying to cause unrest in the U.S.? Yes. Is Russia and Vladimir Putin trying to cause unrest in the U.S.? SIMON: Let me begin with a question this blunt. Her book is "The Future Is History: How Totalitarianism Reclaimed Russia." Masha Gessen joins us from our studios in New York. Masha Gessen, who is the daughter of Soviet dissidents, one of the founders of the Pink Triangle Campaign in Russia and a respected writer on Russia who now lives in New York, has written a book about what she calls the story of freedom that was not embraced in democracy, that was not desired. How many Americans - Democrats and Republicans - would disagree with that now? ![]() Mitt Romney received a lot of ridicule during the 2012 presidential campaign when he said Russia was the No. ![]()
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